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2010, an atf agent is tipped off by an ssl -- ffl. problem.onized as the reality is they are the ones linking this because of their own alertness. that pointis made at to allow the struck purchase to try to continue when we already have the osorio's link and tied with the eagle pass seizures. yet we are going to continue on. my question, and your value couldn, what you determine that these agents allowing would find by dozens of a legally purchased firearms to continue to walk? in this review, like fast and furious, one of the
significant concerns we had. this was a different scenario family outlined but when you see firearm violations and you have the opportunity to make arrests or take other investigative activity given the risk associated with them it is important to do that. the firearms you mentioned had today's to two weeks. can kind of look at within the next month they didn't make a purchase with an agent, but for the more ironic -- firearms with obliterated serial numbers, why not a instant arrest after mark scores illegally trafficked, fully aware of it, and nothing happens in november 2010. why was that? >> the explanation from the dallas field division, bill -->> we would have liked to hear from him. go is less than a
year ago. i am not here to defend that. >> why was no arrests made? scores of firearms, they are going south am a white was tourist made? -- white was no arrests made? >> it was sensitive. >> let's move on from that. here's another problem. tied tothe osorio's this and there is uncertainty on part of the agents by the time they get to february 2011 they are not sure if they find in his bedroom the firearms, whether or not they are allowed to seize them. even i know that if you have your legal firearms in some of his bedroom and a good warrant to go in and check it out, you have to obliterate serial numbers, you are in a deep. the group supervisor for the
firearms trafficking group failed to communicate that. again, i am not defending it. >> this is the frustration we have. we had dedicated agents like yourself who lost their life because people were not doing their job. desire on we had a the part which we have been trying to get to the bottom of, to allow these to walk south for reasons yet to be determined. everyone wants to sweep that under the rug. with regards to my colleagues that have stated about the need for more laws, i would remind everyone that the 1968 gun control act requires serial numbers and has 18 u.s. code 5861 g laying out requirements for what constitutes legal firearms. it is illegal to possess firearms that have serial
numbers removed, obliterated, or altered. are you familiar with a don't lie for the other guy program? goodness,hem but my 17 years we have had that program. is it or is not a felony to make a straw purchase? we are talking about the need from your own mouth, and acknowledgment to the worries that we need to have a law to prevent this type of trafficking. law >> not aware of the ? i am aware of it. >> do you know what the colonies are -- penalties are? a 10 year penalty for federal crime and a $250,000 fine. u.s. code 18 section 924 see any. -- cne. we are talking about this issue.
i have every believe that you are dedicated to your job. right now we have three empty chairs and you that does not even seem to know what the u.s. coast guard. i would like to believe that you do know those. mr. chairman, i would suggest that we had a regroup. the rating number has not allowed to have his witness. others we have not even gotten to get to the tobacco issues. we needed to have some follow on here. mr. horwitz i and grateful for the things you dug up. you are dedicated. i tell you what, it not looking too pretty here today. aware there are two statues. a 10 year. i also would like to comment about federal firearms licensees.
we have built a better relationship and communication with the federal firearms licensee because they are the front line of defense. you want to the atf webpage things wasone of the the number of burglaries that have happened across the country. things that were not tracked until five years ago. i wanted to share that i have a passion for recognizing and regulating an industry and good honest hard-working men and women dealing in a lawful commodity. those are absolutely vital to the intelligence based business and they should have followed up when they gave those names. that should have been an alarm going off. thank you for making the left -- letting me make that comment. >> the children from massachusetts mr. lynch. lynch: i want to echo the request for a follow-up on this.
i think we really do need to drill a down. last month in the new york times , a story raising troubling questions about atf's use of confidential informants in the tobacco operation underway from .011-2013 i ask unanimous consent to enter this story by matt puzo new york times february 22. atf fills a secret bank account with millions from shadowy cigarette sales. directinge reported inform us to engage in sham transactions with a collective of tobacco farmers. the books the off proceeds in an undercover atf investigation. this is called turning -- churning, you use those funds to turn your
own operation. >> for continuing operations. in this case did possess a special authority granted to it under the bush administration, it allows the black like market cash -- , a news report further alleged that this operation exceeded that authority. do you believe that they exceeded the authority? >> like a testified previously and included in my opening statement, the united states government is party to civil litigation and i cannot comments that. the judge has it under seal. >> how long is it going to be in place? >> i believe it is until the 24th of this month. >> good. good. >> we will give you plenty of extra time to make up for this. you commented that we are allowed to do.
what have you done to address the court and ask permission to comply with a congressional request for that material? you call the judge and petition the courts. we go through this regularly. we don't have these prohibitions. that information should be given to us. we need you to approach the court and tell them the. i'm a you are in in order to release that information. mr. chairman, we have had conversations with the doj, the u.s. attorneys over the civil litigation. the ball is in your hands and you need to approach the tort and make the request give them permission to comply with a congressional directive. >> i will take that back. >> thank you.
i reclaim my time. are you familiar with this particular use of confidential informants for this cigarette scam which apparently generated millions of dollars and were put in these accounts? 2013'm familiar with the audit and the work we did there any problems we found. --vet thesewe best informants? under the reno guidelines there are certain conduct that would disqualify someone from being a confidential informant on behalf of the atf. were these folks invented -- vetted? broadly, weay more found in our audit that in 33 of the 35 instances we looked at in
2013, the critical information required i policy to start the operation wasn't present and we found a major investigation that has never been approved and the committee that was supposed to meet to review it never met. issuing a report on atf handling of the confidential informants more broadly beyond this matter and concert may discuss with you when we get that report over the next month or so, those issues further. >> i know your previous answer was limited, because of the seal, is there anything you wish to dispute that has put out here ? the allegations are very serious. >> the thing i would like to assert is what the oig, their thorough investigation of the cases as you said where we recognize there was a problem.
, the policy was lacking. the oversight was lacking. the leadership was poor. there is not been a case since 2013 but a couple met the oig because they did an excellent report or we corroborated fully and there are no outstanding recommendations from the oig. that still out there? it came from the bush administration. is it just your own decision not to operate that way? ande put in a tight policy to us your question it is still out there. no request for churning investigations because it is a very tight policy and standard to open a investigation and we have not done so. >> from the accounts, the cash coming in and going back out, .elf-contained
there is the opportunity for abuse. any recommendations that you have with the way this is handled? >> we made several in connection it ishat review and report that we made for the department. they made recommendations to the deputy ag's office because of the broader concern. clearly, there needs to be far stricter controls in place back then. atf has made changes in response and the -- >> was anybody disciplined for wesley describes going on in the new york times officer -- article? >> i am limited in what i can say other than as we indicated in the audit, our auditors referred matters for further investigation into our agents. i know the chairman has a
government request and i believe it is due tomorrow. prepared to deliver those documents? >> like i testified, i told people from the field they have been working for the weekend and we are diligently working to comply. >> i have exhausted my time. asterisk. a great big you're not going to provide us the things you believe are under seal by the court. i'm going to have to comply with the u.s. attorney office and doj dealing with those legal matters. as a follow-up, if we get to the away,nd that seal goes a.b. we reconvene this hearing
with our folks and go at this again. >> we will no doubt have people back. it has been a long-term practice prior to me that this should not is not alitigation prohibition on congress being able to do its job. we plan to issue a subpoena. of what we asked for, we will send you a subpoena. we plan to send that on you the 13th. we would rather have you give us all the documents we request must we don't recognize the civil litigation. given our constitutional duties. just one question. i want to go back for a moment. this is a court seal, right? i assume it is a court. >> that is my understanding but
i have not been involved. >> if the court seals it, the court has to unseal it. it does not matter. we are dealing with that on the report that we issued on another matter, we are asking the department to go back to the court and get it unsealed. it is our belief that a seal bars them from making it public but to provide it to the united states congress is not one of those prohibitions of the seal. the court seal, i should say. them -- somebody from making it public. asdon't recognize the seal something that prohibits
congress from doing its job. that is our position. i know that puts you in a tough spot but kerry message back if you will. thank you. we recognize mr. grothman from the state of wisconsin for five minutes. >> you have seen a lot of interesting things today. are you aware of any other examples in the last five years -- that has lead to errors in investigations? as i sit here i cannot think of anything off the top of my head. i do think we found in the storefronts report that we did, i have to go back and refresh myself, concerns about its coordination and some of those storefronts that were several years back with state and federal prosecutors and the coordination between them on who would take which cases. what are youenton,
doing to make sure that your agents coordinate with the u.s. attorneys as quickly as possible? he has established a frontline business model in the beginning of 2012. every special agent in charge of a division has to do a domain assessment. they had to share that with the u.s. attorney and the criminal chief to make sure that atf is in step with the u.s. attorney and it makes us more efficient and effective on our resources to make sure what we're investigation -- investigating that there will be a prosecution. prosecutors want good cases, i don't bring them. that is our job.
-- i don't blame them. across the country, u.s. attorneys have different challenges and what they are wanting to investigate with their resources so it is not the same across the board a-- beard. >> you never change or method because you believe it is not likely to lead to prosecution? theif it did not look like u.s. attorney would take it, we would go to the state attorney general's office for secretion. you feel you have the responsibility to disrupt firearms trafficking even if you think you are unable to obtain a prosecution or conviction? >> yes and as i testified i believe the deterrence credit that we give agents has helped of storen a number purchases where they get scared off and let them know they have come under atf intention. i keep using the expression but
beyond the left side of boom, in the culture. if we are not going to get a prosecution, we put in emphasis --public safety with deterrence of firearms getting into the wrong hands. >> and wants to go back to something that mr. lynch was talking about. situation, turning that really calls for some folks to be cooperating. peoplee to have several working together to make that happen, right? >> is my understanding. i know we cannot get into that too much, i was kind
of surprised to even see that. were you? stas --s not audit identified some of situations and that circumstance may not only found a home with the controls over the bank accounts, the informants, but the spirit himself. frankly, i wasn't particularly surprised. >> you think this is people in the agency saying, we will use
any method it necessary to get the job done? are there people that say we don't care? how does this appear? -- you can let any agency or any organization of iulled into a culture do it the way i want to do it. i was asking about taking several people. how to be even get there? i don't want to see is happening again. i should not be opening the new york times and reading about this kind of stuff. the issues that we identified, the issues in fast and furious, the storefronts report, things before the committee on the da side, those were not generally speaking as you just indicated one of person
running,. they were multiple people without adequate controls being able to do what they thought in most of those instances. were advancing law enforcement interests when in fact they weren't. >> thank you. along lines of the ranking member mentioning, when you have come testified before, on lessons learned and doing recent nonpartisan interventions. does atf maintain a database of federal law enforcement weapons lost or stolen? >> no we do not. in the san francisco bay area, there has been a lot of lost andention in the stolen weapons by state and local and federal officers. their livesave lost
because of lost and stolen federal weapons. one by an agent from the bureau of land management that led to the tragic death of case finally -- a larger discussion from the president and congress about immigration status. the gun that was used in that were federal law enforcement officers who had weapons stolen. could you at least, led by atf, traded policy for all federal law enforcement on proper storage of weapons so we would not have the situation in san francisco that happens a lot. san francisco, if there's anything in the car, thieves will bring a window and grabbed and snatch and grab anything in there.
sense,s to me, common that you would it lead an effort to make sure that there best policy possible whether it requires statute or not. you would make sure that these kinds of things would minimized. the fact that you don't even create a database to follow these things seems to me to be negligence in the extreme. personally, having seen people suffer the consequences, my question is the state of california responded to this by passing a statute that required federal and state agencies, because they have been guilty of the same thing and white tragically to law enforcement officers. i had a constituent who is a police chief and his weapons were still in a driveway. there used to commit a crime and he was horrified.
i have heard the culture question. friends of mine and saying you should not be imposing these. let us take care of it. i think it is incumbent on you outthe ig has pointed this to develop better inventory control and better accountability and consequences for federal law enforcement officers and better preventative practice. federal agents will have to comply with that and if you are aware of how you are helping to comply with that effort and why we don't do it on a national level, i don't think it needs a statute. i think you can do it administratively as it would help a great deal. could you respond to those observations? >> yes. you describe tragedies. i remember reading in the paper. as far as atf and the other , our inventoryl
is annual, a count for every firearm. i share my sensitivity to what you are saying. , in i was a deputy director increased the penalty if an agent had a firearms stolen out of their car to a mandatory five year -- five days off without compensation and it could not be reduced. i was sending a message because of the sensitivity which has become a prominent amongst people stealing guns out of cars. ,'ve got to st. petersburg please lock your car up and secure your firearm. in memphis the police chief was saying the same thing. i support that whether or not atf would be the custodian of everyone's firearms. i believe it is being done at each law enforcement bureau or component and we do and annual inventory and any firearm that is stolen is investigated by
internal affairs. the oig has a chance to review the files and it will go through four process for discipline. >> i hope all those changes actually result in a positive thing that we both want but it is not working so far. we just had another incident with an fbi agent in the california office in my hometown. multiple weapons were taken. it is not working. that lawon is, given enforcement has said over and over again, we are doing things as you pointed out. it is not working. there will be some margin of error and there will be some instances but we are doing enough. request is we need to do things across the board to all federal agencies in the state of california and make sure particularly on the front end on the storage of the
notons and when they are used. if they are not on your person a new law says they have to be locked in your trunk and have a lock. i would ask you and the committee that we continue to pursue this in the prevention area. so we do not have these tragic situations, knowing they may happen on occasion. they are happening far too often. is secureolicy firearms in the vehicle. it has to not just be in the trunk but in a container in the trunk that is designed for firearms storage. >> my only observation is that is great but it is not working across all federal agencies to the degree you have enforced that. >> we have a quarterly meeting at doj with the fbi, dea marshals and the fbi. i will bring us up at the meeting as a topic of firearm
storage. >> i appreciate that. >> that is a good point. the committee is happy to follow-up and perhaps we could get an inventory or some sort of indication as to what they are doing or not doing. let us work with you on that. i will recognize myself. you said earlier that your office found no criminal conduct from anyone involved in fast and furious. i want to ask about former atf phoenix filled division assistant special agent george to let -- fast and.volved in free of he personally purchased a firearm. what happens to that firearm? >> it was transferred by him to a non-u.s. national. >> he sold it to a non-us national. what happened with that gun? where did they find it?
>> if i recall correctly it was the scene of a crime i don't -- i would have to go back and make sure i remember. >> i definitely recall it as well. 4473,ou filled out form are you allowed to use the work address or are you supposed to use your home address question mark >> the residence you live at. if you put something other than the home address can you prosecute those crimes? is that a crime? >> if you knowingly put something false on a form it is. >> the form says put your home address. >> i believe so. >> something other than your home address would be inaccurate. >> i bought a gun last summer and i put my apartment. >> so, did the inspector
general's office make any recommendation to the department of justice to consider lightingng him for about his address on form 4473? mr. borowitz? >> i don't believe we did. what we have been told or were law enforcement agents of the department, many -- do not use their home address for security purposes but instead use a po box or ups box or some other location and that was not sufficient evidence of intent to war in a criminal prosecution. >> even though he sold it to a non-us national and it used -- it used an apparatus -- use an address different on a form.
that is hard for the american people to understand, white that waiver or these forms -- where they publicly available? if you look on the internet. up, let's gook find an atf agent and a look at his forms. there his address. what are we trying to protect from? is that common practice? are they putting their work address? >> i was surprised at his response. i'm glad he is off of atf. he was not one of our best. the people who were doing undercover work, atf would provide undercover identification and that would be the permissible type. if i remember correctly he was
dropbox as a meal place, a po box, bash at eight meal place, a po box -- at a mail obc -- box. >> there's a group supervisor who is supposed to have responsibility year. at thease used, asleep switch. did it take for you to figure out -- not you personally but the organization -- how long did it take atf to figure out there was someone asleep at the switch? what happened to him? was he fired, disciplined, bonuses? >> the person retired from atf. this?a result of
tell me the time span. >> i knew the employee, the oig interviewed him. he retired before the report came out and his reputation was leadert of a dynamic that was engaged. >> can you weigh in? >> i understanding he's -- my understanding is he retired in june 2012. before december 2012 when we began our review. we have talked in general that access issues to a host of things. are you having access issues at the atf? >> we are not. i want to be clear. the delay had nothing to do with any access issues. >> on a broader sense, are there
access issues that you care to highlight here? >> currently we do not. the atf has been very good. even having fights with the dea as the eye. actually was in connection with the fast and furious matter. good news. congratulations, we thank you for that. my time is expired. >> i did not want anyone to think i am lying. there was another employee that retired at the end of 2016 that the oig was critical of in documenting his surveillance and interview of an ssl. that is what i was referring to my head. >> thank you. >> back to mr. lynch of massachusetts. the want to go back to cigarette smuggling case.
you had atf agents working with at least a couple of informants in that case. it says here in the new york times article that they were funneling tens of millions of dollars. they are using the black market cash to pay the informants. is that a usual practice? if i can comment, not particularly to this investigation. in general and how the oig's report was spot on. deficient, policy was deficient and it is a hot mess. that's why we shut it down. since 2013 13 there is not been a number one. i welcome when everything that in case the government as a part of it. i am trying to follow your
investigation. you did a very good report. i think it was 2013, you went 2006 to aboutuary june of 2011. we have that block of time. whered reports there informants were being paid. some of them a million dollars. $1 million per year to pay an informant. at that point working with the dea. now we have another report from the new york times that goes to january and february 2011. it is within the scope of your study. there is some overlap.
is your investigation -- did you cover this? accounts?ver the i am trying to figure out is the money being reported properly? who did it go to? how much money are these folks getting? >> i don't know all the specifics of the matter and what is under seal -- even what my auditors looked at and the accounts they looked at, i believe we looked at the breadth of the accounts atf was using covers audit report those in full and the problems we identified covered that. june 2011 inhed in our fieldwork, one of the reasons it took time to issue that report was because as we 2011, atf our work in
was making many of the changes that acting director brandon outlined. what we ended up doing was updating our audit report which caused us to want to make sure we were picking up some of the changes they made. they asked us to look at some of the changes they made. the am trying to get timeline down to make sure you are looking at this case. it appears that you did. >> i do not know all the specifics of what is under seal but if it fell into a poco between june 2 thousand 11, i think it is safe to say that our auditors looked at the scope of their accounts through june 2011 and my guess is the acting andctor, given our back
forth, can probably speak to that as well as whether we looked at all the accounts. the 24thl wait until and have another bite at that. i yield back. it would be legislative malpractice. if i did not ask these questions. ,n the inner city of baltimore you have situations where young men it can get a gun as fast as a cigarette. it is interesting that there has been a proliferation sale of guns. , how doesondering that make your job harder? how do you deal with that?
you don't have to sugarcoat. i believe the atf has been treated like a stepchild. some if they are had their way who would get rid of you guys immediately. the reasons why mr. lynch's questions are so significant and one of the reasons why fast and furious was so significant is because it then it gives people who do not like you and your organization justification to treat your organization the way it is treated. anybody who knows anything about , i believe that with my heart. i attended the funerals of young usually black men
elicit talk about chicago. one of our members told you earlier you got to do more with less, pretty much. so if the president came to you how can werandon, helpur resources best to places like baltimore in chicago? what would you say? i know about the task force. we have got that in baltimore. that to me is important but to say atf, look at the situation, do it every want.
what would your recommendation the. it's probably going to come to you if it hasn't already or somebody is going to come to you. >> congressman, i appreciate the question. >> i'm not trying to put you on the spot. i'm curious because i want to be effective and efficient in whatever we do. i know you do too. >> i would love the opportunity. i think everybody wants to be tight with the taxpayers money, and i'm one of those persons. one of the things from the major city cheese that they all said is what we would do is go on with enhanced enforcement --iciates that initiatives enhanced enforcement initiatives. there is a network that is been a game changer. it is where the casings at shootings, and perhaps, i don't know this was done with your nephew, but that is entered into what they call a microscope that
with a digital signature on the casing, much like a fingerprint. when you have a conference of collection plan with the pd's and it goes through and links up shootings in different states and to go after people. if i had a chance to talk to president trump, this is not me asking to be -- we have done more with less, but this is good for the american public. $50 million to $100 million for this technology. the example was when i was at san diego, the international association of chiefs of police, i was speaking before the police executive research forum. he said our pd got shot at. within 12 hours, we collected that. had that scanned in and it went down into our correlation and training center where we said how can we serve the state and locals better? within 12 hours we sent the response back and said that
shooting at that p.d. is matched up to three other shootings. it went to our gun intelligence center. the misery of fast and furious and i don't defend it, we collect analyze, synthesize and , disseminate information rapidly. or four guyse locked up within 24 hours. if i had the president's year, that's what i would say. that's what's ear, i would say. it is a game changer for investigative leads on what i refer to as trigger pullers and then to go after the traffickers supplying them with firearms. i think it is something everybody can wrap their arms around because, as you well know, and i spent a lot of my career in detroit -- the victims, it is painful to watch people being shot and the misery it does on the families and the shootings even at funerals. i've done surveillances on those. to answer your question, i
believe, even if i was a taxpayer outside of a.t.f., this is something worthy of attention to address the gun violence across america and to reiterate the point, i think we have made a lot of progress working with local p.d.'s. on federal firearm licensees burglaries. last year, there were over 7,500 guns stolen during f.f.l. burglaries. we're trying to say -- prevent that, working with the national shooting sports foundation and others and the shot show and so forth to educate for security. it is different than an armed robbery where we can hit them with 924-c. the hobbs act and so forth. f.f.l. burglary is a different animal. that is what i would say in is
not -- it's just the right thing. >> thank you very much. >> these machines, they cost how much? >> mr. chairman, i have to go back. i think it may be $129,000. if i may comment, the cost of this which is just like fire , departments have come across the country and tactical teams doing regionalization, not every p.d. needs a machine where you -- where they have memorandums of agreement and i know of other p.d.'s that say come down on tuesday and enter all of your casings. it is an expensive item but it saves lives. >> we would like to work with you. i would love to learn more about it. if you could educate us, i would love to help you get more of them. >> i really appreciate it. >> that would be great. you said something that really caught my ear. it is something the committee has been looking at and we would
really appreciate your help. i was encouraged when you said the statistics that you have at your disposal, you said "we don't want to waste our time on cases that won't be prosecuted." that's true of every law enforcement agency i have ever encountered. there is nothing more frustrating than the men and women who go out there and do the hard work and put a case together and then the prosecutor says it is not as sexy or jury friendly as we hoped it would be. so we're not going to do anything here. in order for us to get our arms wrapped around that, providing us -- i think a three-year window, unless someone else wants to weigh in here. i don't want to go back 15 years. if you can look back over the past three years and give us some statistics, here is how many straw purchasing cases we had.
here is how many not -- i have to push the department of justice to find out what they are actually prosecuting. my guess is everyone of your agents already knows if i give them this paperwork, they are not going to prosecute so why , bother, right? i want to know what those cases are. i want to know what you have given them. in the example of the parallel i'm giving is the t.s.a. t.s.a. i cannot say enough about their instagram account. you want to go see an amazing instagram account, go to the t.s.a. every day they are putting up pictures of guns and other types of weapons and knives and things people are trying to bring on airplanes. when you work with the local law enforcement, when you work with the prosecutors, it is crickets. they almost never prosecute anybody. and my guess is we're having the exact same phenomenon throughout
the country with these gun violations. i need exposure to that. that's where your help providing us statistics, sooner rather than later. i don't know what time frame to put on that but you said they were fairly easy to put together. can you get back to us in a reasonable time to provide us those statistics? >> mr. chairman, i would be happy to. >> that would be really helpful. please do familiarize yourself with that case highlighted in the new york times. we will be having a hearing about this. i need to know that you're personally involved and engaged on this and you're willing to cooperate with us on that investigation? do i have your cooperation on this? >> mr. chairman, you absolutely do and whatever i'm legally allowed to do without getting in a jam with a federal judge, again, i'm all yours to testify. >> i know i said it a couple of times, but you're providing congress the information requested is not making that information public and not only
do we not recognize the so to -- seal so to speak but we don't , believe it binds you. but i know there are lots attorneys that will give you advice. we don't think you have to pursue that in the court. if you think you have to, i want to make sure you're at least asking. >> mr. chairman? >> yes. >> let me say this to you. so often we have these hearings and things don't get tied up properly. i just want to you -- let me tell you what i told the chairman a few minutes ago about you. i said i believe this guy is a good guy. and that he may not have fully understood the invitation because i do feel your , sincerity.
i have interviewed a lot of witnesses in my career as a lawyer. i just want to thank you for your candor. but i have to tell you something about this guy. he can be kind of nice, but once he thinks you understand him -- you think you saw some fury today? he gets worse. all i'm saying is that you're now on notice that an invitation , make sure the folks get here as best you can. ok? >> my former boss said the education of tom brandon continues. meant no disrespect. was trying to do the right thing. but hey, obviously it didn't go that well. but i appreciate your comments about me being candid and open. that's my m.o. >> we also thank you for your service.
>> i appreciate that. >> you have been through a lot. you have seen a lot. >> fast and furious, changed my life. i stayed in the game. i stayed in the fight because i love the men and women of a.t.f. who do a vital and important mission of protecting our nation. the a.t.f. of 2017 is not the a.t.f. of 2010 when much of this stuff happened. thank you for allowing me to say that. >> thank you very much. >> and i want to thank you for your service and your candor. you're earning our respect the proof will be in the pudding as we move forward. i do believe you too. hopefully we understand each other and d.o.j. understands us as well. i think we made the message clear and i appreciate you working with us. back to your service in the united states marines and moving forward, you have done a lot for this nation. put your life on the line on a regular basis, which is more than most people do and we
admire and i can't say enough about the men and women who also serve with you in doing that because, you know, we're up here wearing ties and are real critical and yet you see the 16-hour days these people put in dealing with the worst scum you can possibly imagine and i want you to know we all recognize that and are grateful that people will step up and do that, not only with a.t.f. but other departments and agencies as well . everybody from border patrol to working in the prisons. it is tough. it is tough. we don't say or praise people enough for the good work and the sacrifices they make and their families make and their spouses, their kids, their friends, their family, their parents. it is tough. and they do amazing work. we never compensate them enough. but i do hope from time to time we stop and pause and recognize them. again, i think it is one of the
beauties of this nation is that we have these kind of candid, really candid discussions, but we have also got a duty to do on both sides of these tables here and so we appreciate you working with us and helping us to ultimately get to the truth and make things better and to mr. horowitz again, the number of people that work with you know how much we appreciate them. thank all the members here today. it is an important topic and something we will continue to follow up on. the committee stands adjourned. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2017] [crowd noise]
subcommittee hearing today at 9:00 eastern on c-span 2. in the afternoon, a number of native american tribal protest the dakota access pipeline and acrosse xl pipeline the street from the white house. that is also live on c-span 2. c-span, or history unfolds daily. in 1979, c-span was created as a public service by america's cable television companies and is brought to you today by your cable or satellite provider. washington journal is next. we will take a look at today's news and take your phone calls. also this morning, the house work on modifying rules governing the state and federal lawsuits. you can watch live house coverage starting at 9:00 a.m. eastern. coming up next on washington journal, virginia congress been scott taylor will talk about president trump's revised travel executive order, only security initiatives and defense
spending. in florida congresswoman val demings discusses the trump administration's approach to law enforcement and its crackdown on undocumented immigrants. ♪ host: good morning. republican's health care rep. poe: best health care proposal is on its way to the house for after two marathon markups yesterday. the budget committee and will committee will get their hands on the plan, with conservatives balking at the gop effort. paul ryan but before cameras yesterday for a 23 minute powerpoint presentation to his republican colleagues. he said the time is now. we want to know from all of you if you agree or disagree with the speaker. this is how we are dividing the lines. those of you insured under the informal care